Vitality Points

Orange Joined: Jul 06, 2007 Posts: 24

When we first create a character, does the character automatically get maximum hit points at first level based on his/her Class? If so, how come the Constitution modifier is not being added?

For example; my character is a 1st level Soldier with 10 VPs. He has a Constitution of 12 (+1 modifier) and the Soldier's Hit Die is d10.

Orange Joined: Dec 04, 2006 Posts: 25

I don't thinkg the modifiers do anything to that top center block of information. I think the only way to increase that is to move up in levels. But I"m not total clear on all that stuff.

Orange Joined: Jul 06, 2007 Posts: 24

Well this is based on the Star Wars d20 rules, correct? In those rules, the Constitution modifier is added (or subtracted in the case of a negative Constitution modifier) to the Vitality Point Hit Die roll each time a character gainst a level.

Orange Joined: Dec 04, 2006 Posts: 25

I don't know about all that but I'm guessing that if your right all that happens maybe when your actualy in combat and it gets added then. Like I said I don't know much how it works. So in other words I'm probibly not the person that should be helping you.

Joined: Jan 11, 2002 Posts: 3061 Location: USA

Quote:

So in other words I'm probibly not the person that should be helping you.

But thanks for trying! We're an open community, we appreciate all the help.

Yes the rules are based on the current d20 (not Saga) revised rule book. We've had to tweak them to streamline things.

For VP, I believe the max points are applied in order to stop anyone from trying to reroll and "beat the system" - I would think the Constitution mod would apply here but I'm not entirely sure either.

Ultraviolet Joined: Aug 15, 2005 Posts: 237

It's SUPPOSED to, I don't know if it actually does in the code, since I have no access to the code and wouldn't understand it if I did. LOL.

Joined: Jan 11, 2002 Posts: 3061 Location: USA

Talin Fost wrote:

since I have no access to the code and wouldn't understand it if I did

I do have acesss to the code, I wrote it.. and I still don't understand it Smile

It should be applying modifiers everywhere, so tracking down one is a little tough. It's a very robust system.

Dark Lord of Selur Joined: Sep 01, 2005 Posts: 647

As far as the rules goes, you should get maximum of your hit dice at first level plus CON modifier (minimum of 1). After level afterwards, you would get a random roll of your hit dice (solider gets 1d10, noble 1d6, etc) and add your CON modifier (minimum gain of 1). Thus, at every level, you should get at least 1.

If for some reason your CON bonus increase, the VP should increase by +1 per level to reflect this.

Orange Joined: Jul 06, 2007 Posts: 24

Well then either something is wrong with the code, or it just decided to mess with my character, because being a Soldier with a Constitution of 12 (+1 modifier), I should start at 1st level with 11 VPs. Instead, it shows me as having only 10.

Joined: Jan 11, 2002 Posts: 3061 Location: USA

Kooro wrote:

If for some reason your CON bonus increase, the VP should increase by +1 per level to reflect this.

I know this doesn't deal with new characters, but for anyone leveling up, this is not retroactive. That is, if the VP increase is done, the CON bonus would be applied once to that level only.

Orange Joined: Jul 06, 2007 Posts: 24

It's not retroactive? It's suppose to be.

Joined: Jan 11, 2002 Posts: 3061 Location: USA

I'm saying it won't be in this system, due the mechanism of coding.
You "should" get the maximum VP per level, with the modifier, when you level up. But the modifier will not be retroactively recalculated and applied.. so the highest VP change would be max VP + mod (no retroactive +levels). I think this is fair, considering the original d20 was a randomization and not a max. You'll still end up with a VP that's like the d20 system.. probably even better than what you would get with dice. Plus it simplifies the overall coding.. that is, there isn't a historical record of every change per levelup.

We're still not sure whether the modifier is being applied all. My guess is no, but I will have to debug more of the code to verify it.

Ultraviolet Joined: Aug 15, 2005 Posts: 237

Actually, I don't think it's even supposed to be retroactive in the d20 system. AFAIK, the rulebooks don't say that.

Orange Joined: Jul 06, 2007 Posts: 24

Retroactive hit point accumulation is part of the base rules of the D20 System. This applies to both temporary and permanent increases to the Constitution score. Likewise, temporary and permanent decreases to the Constitution score result in loss of hit points.

For example: A 10th level Soldier has a Constitution score of 15 (+2 modifier) and 84 VPs. Any affect that increases his Constition to 16, whether permanent or temporary, will increase his VPs to 94 (Constitution modifier increases to +3, that's a +1 increase, multiplied by 10 levels, equals 10 extra VPs). In the case of a temporary increase, the 10 'extra' VPs are also temporary and lasts as long as the temporary increase lasts.

If a player's Constitution score is decreased, whether temporarily or permanently, it also results in VP loss.

For example: Using the same character as above, let's say the Soldier fails a Fortitude Save against a poison resulting in 2 points of Constituion damage. This lowers his Constitution modifier from +2 to +1, a difference of 1. Again, multiply the difference by 10 character levels, and you get 10. So not only does the Soldier take 2 points of temporary Constitution damage, but his total Vitality Points are also reduced by 10 temporarily. Of course, the Constitution damage would also affect his Wound Points.

Bottom line is that BOTH temporary and permanent increases (and decreases) affect a character retroactively.

Dark Lord of Selur Joined: Sep 01, 2005 Posts: 647

A few things are retroactive in the d20 system, permanent CON modifier is one of them.

Saga makes everything retroactive (you can use a starting feat that you couldn't use at first until you meet all the prerequisite even if that happens much later in character development). However, from a coding point of view (limited experience here), retroactive is a bit difficult but doable.